Newcomer What is more “third world” - Buenos Aires or San Francisco

[Frisel]

Buenos Aires: good public schools in middle class neighborhoods within el centro that teach high schoolers algebra, no giant homeless encampments or open air drug markets, no violent mentally ill thugs fighting you in public transport

SF: has Whole Foods (except the one they just closed down to crime

 

[MenClerk]

Here we go.

 

[earlyretirement]

SF is a hellhole in many areas. It smells like urine on many streets and looters just taking whatever they want off the shelves and often times setting up tables a few blocks where they stole it and reselling it because they aren't getting prosecuted. It's really shocking.

 

[AmirJacks]

San Francisco is literal hell on earth. All of Buenos Aires bad points multiplied by 5 and none of its good points

 

[earlyretirement]

There are certainly nicer parts of San Francisco. I don't think anyone is disputing that. Some parts are really beautiful and clean. But in general since COVID, it's just gone way way downhill. I'm not comparing BA to SF. Just saying that I've dreaded my last couple trips to SF for work over the past year.


The homeless situation has gotten really bad in many cities in Southern California.

 

[NigjeFs]

SF was the first city I visited outside of Arg. It was a long tine ago ( 20 yrs ) and I fell in live with it. I wonder what happened there? RE prices were very high back then too. I wandered into some sketchy areas, never felt unsafe. The worst was going into some McDonalds by a park, it was mainly homeless looking people in there ( very different to MCD restaurants here ).

 

[earlyretirement]

SF was the first city I visited outside of Arg. It was a long tine ago ( 20 yrs ) and I fell in live with it. I wonder what happened there? RE prices were very high back then too. I wandered into some sketchy areas, never felt unsafe. The worst was going into some McDonalds by a park, it was mainly homeless looking people in there ( very different to MCD restaurants here ).

It’s still a very beautiful city in many parts of the city. What’s happened over the years (especially since COVID) is that the homeless situation has gotten so bad. They have had very liberal mayors and governmental officials that don’t prosecute criminals stealing in stores and cars. So there is rampant crime and homelessness in many parts of the city.

Just Google San Francisco looting and you will get a good idea what people are getting away with there.

How looting turned the most upscale part of San Francisco into a ghost town

Two weeks ago, San Francisco was the first of several progressive cities hit by smash-and-grab mobs of thieves.

nypost.com

 

[Britni]

It’s still a very beautiful city in many parts of the city. What’s happened over the years (especially since COVID) is that the homeless situation has gotten so bad. They have had very liberal mayors and governmental officials that don’t prosecute criminals stealing in stores and cars. So there is rampant crime and homelessness in many parts of the city.

Just Google San Francisco looting and you will get a good idea what people are getting away with there.

How looting turned the most upscale part of San Francisco into a ghost town

Two weeks ago, San Francisco was the first of several progressive cities hit by smash-and-grab mobs of thieves.

nypost.com

FYI. Fox News is officially on record, by its own admission last week, of lying repeatedly and purposefully. It's like Rupert said: it's all about the money. Fox News is by its own admission not a news organization, so I wouldn't credit anything it had to report about the last presidental election much less anything about San Francisco.

 

[earlyretirement]

FYI. Fox News is officially on record, by its own admission last week, of lying repeatedly and purposefully. It's like Rupert said: it's all about the money. Fox News is by its own admission not a news organization, so I wouldn't credit anything it had to report about the last presidental election much less anything about San Francisco.

Yeah Fox News sucks. I don't watch it either but you don't need to watch Fox News to know that things have come unhinged in SF. And that's speaking personally from going there personally. (I live in California).


I'm not trying to say that BA is better than SF (or any other city). I tend not to try to compare BA to other cities like that as they are like comparing apples and oranges.

BA is not perfect either. All cities have their issues. It's not just SF. Many cities across the USA have really gone downhill after COVID.

Generally, if you have money in the USA you can avoid any bad areas and be blind to it all if you want to. I live in Southern California where other than cost of living and crazy high prices for housing, rent, food, electricity and just about any other expense, life is pretty good. We do have crazy amounts of homelessness in many cities but fortunately it's limited to just a few neighborhoods. But if you venture down to the areas where all the homeless are, you'd swear you were in a Mad Max movie with tents all over the sidewalk and homeless yelling and screaming at everyone.

 

[NigjeFs]

Was commenting on this post with my husband,and he was saying that in his opinion it is not so much about politics but about mental illness not being addressed in the US in general,then due to California's perfect weather it just attracts people that would find it a lot harder to survive in cities that get snow, etc. In such a rich and developed country,I fail to understand why there is no universal public healthcare system like the Canadian. Public schools seem to work just fine there.

 

[RinderHerts]

While "third world" is pretty meaningless, I spend about 6 months north and 6 months south, and I would say that in many ways, Buenos Aires is more civilized, easier to live in with less money, and safer.
The US right now is a war zone on so many levels, and the inflation is officially nonexistent, but eggs cost 6 bucks a dozen and gas is $4.50 a gallon at costco right now. Average rents in most cities are 60% or more of salaries, its a quilombo up here.

 

[Lenono]

I am calling it a tie. Both cities have many first world attributes, though it varies a lot by area. The aspect which I personally feel is 3rd world by Buenos Aires is the high level of dishonesty in business and government. Even many very affluent people chase away future business in order to steal today.

 

[Dexter]

To purchase goods and get mail? BsAs is more third world. To walk the street? SF. No question, and it's relatively obvious I would think. Can you even have lunch on the sidewalk nowadays in SF? Or put any merchandise on the sidewalk? Societal collapse hasn't happened in BsAs, probably due to demographics and if that point is too harsh....don't care; tell NPR about it.

 

[MiltonHouses]

To purchase goods and get mail? BsAs is more third world. To walk the street? SF. No question, and it's relatively obvious I would think. Can you even have lunch on the sidewalk nowadays in SF? Or put any merchandise on the sidewalk? Societal collapse hasn't happened in BsAs, probably due to demographics and if that point is too harsh....don't care; tell NPR about it.

I had a sidewalk lunch in SF last week (at Tony's), and had my iPhone sitting on the table the whole time. Never worried once.

 

[GerardX]

This thread just proves how delusional and out of touch most expats are, with their dollar incomes living in upper middle and upper class neighborhoods while almost 50% of the population lives in poverty.

But, Tucker Carlson played a segment on trans read alongs and a group of minorities burglarizing a Walgreens in San Francisco, so it must be more "third world' there.

 

[FelipeMex]

This thread just proves how delusional and out of touch most expats are, with their dollar incomes living in upper middle and upper class neighborhoods while almost 50% of the population lives in poverty.

But, Tucker Carlson played a segment on trans read alongs and a group of minorities burglarizing a Walgreens in San Francisco, so it must be more "third world' there.

Yeah its a bit repugnant people claiming San Francisco is more 3rd world than Buenos Aires.

 

[earlyretirement]

While "third world" is pretty meaningless, I spend about 6 months north and 6 months south, and I would say that in many ways, Buenos Aires is more civilized, easier to live in with less money, and safer.
The US right now is a war zone on so many levels, and the inflation is officially nonexistent, but eggs cost 6 bucks a dozen and gas is $4.50 a gallon at costco right now. Average rents in most cities are 60% or more of salaries, its a quilombo up here.

Totally true about the crazy inflation here in the USA that is much much higher than what the government publishes. Obviously nothing like Argentina but it's crazy expensive to dine out here or go to the grocery store. Same with rental prices, especially in desirable cities in California.

My biggest worry is that in many of these cities it's going to be too damn expensive for blue collar to afford to live here. In my town last year there was a strike of the garbage company so trash was piling up.

The real cost of living and inflation #'s here remind me of when I was living in Buenos Aires and Kirchner would post these totally fake inflation #'s.

I am calling it a tie. Both cities have many first world attributes, though it varies a lot by area. The aspect which I personally feel is 3rd world by Buenos Aires is the high level of dishonesty in business and government. Even many very affluent people chase away future business in order to steal today.

Argentina has always been like this. It's one of the things that annoyed me the most in Argentina in 20+ years of living there and owning several businesses there. Many there have no sense of ethics or honesty. Or even if you do business with someone for many years eventually they "exit scam" you.

I had a sidewalk lunch in SF last week (at Tony's), and had my iPhone sitting on the table the whole time. Never worried once.

I completely agree. That's one of the best things about the USA. The safety and security of not having to look over your shoulder all the time or use your iPhone in public. I've been to just about every single state in the USA and I've never once been worried that my iPhone would get stolen here. I can't say the same thing about Buenos Aires.

Yeah its a bit repugnant people claiming San Francisco is more 3rd world than Buenos Aires.

I think you can't generalize about either city. There are many parts of SF that are worse than BA but the same thing can be said the other way around too. Much of SF is crazy affluent and just totally high end and pristine.

 

[earlyretirement]

Most smart money know that SF is a dump now. The largest hotel is just walking away from their investment and letting the bank take it back. They don't see any turn around in the near future.

https://sfist.com/2023/06/05/owner-of-sfs-largest-hotel-the-hilton-union-square-is-walking-away-surrendering-it-to-lender/