I know this is an old theme but I'm interested if there are others who find the cost of living difficult to manage. With the dollar stagnant against the peso, I find my costs all the more out of control. The BA Herald had an article the other day predicting 45% inflation this year.
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Economy It's Too Expensive Here!
- Thread starter Cameler
- Start date
I am puzzled by "dollar stagnant against the peso" part. Why on earth it's still 15:1 ? This makes the locals buy real estate easier. Peso is not worth sh*t, and for 15 pesos, you can get 1 dollar. If you have a peso income that adjusts to the inflation, then real estate becomes cheaper.
RichardOne
Member
True assuming Real Estate prices are Steady??
Yes, real estate price is flat
Mart
Member
Unfortunately in order to get inflation under control and get the economy started in the right direction, we all are going to have to feel the pain for a while (many of us have already for a long time). I posted about this before but my light bills went to 5000+ a month. Guess what, I don't like it but it is forcing all of us to be more conscious of electricity. Sucks right but demand was far exceeding supply across the systems. Now the money coming in from the rate increases and the reduced demand b/c people are conscious of how much they're using for the first time, it *should* give the utility companies the time and funds to start repairing an antiquated system that was in no way able to meet the demands. (Now if nothing is done to improve the system and my money just disappears into someone's pockets, I'll be the first to complain!
earlyretirement
Moderator
Try the south of Spain. Really beautiful and was really affordable while I visited last summer. I have a friend that moved near Nerja a few years ago with his wife and kids and really loves it there. Restaurants are great and much cheaper than Argentina. Quality of life seemed great.
JeffJerson
New member
A previous poster on this thread mentioned Nerja, a town that I liked. So I used one of Steve's links to look at properties in Nerja and I bumped up the price limits a bit. What I saw reminded me of how much more finished and stylish the properties in that area are compared to BsAs.
Not to mention shiny clean and well maintained, kinda like the people of Nerja were not seriously depressed and liked where they lived.
Add to that proximity to the ocean and it's got me thinking about it.
Not to mention shiny clean and well maintained, kinda like the people of Nerja were not seriously depressed and liked where they lived.
Add to that proximity to the ocean and it's got me thinking about it.
StiveCosae
Member
I spent a week in Nerja in 2005. It is beautifully situated but very touristy. The high rise hotels aren't very charming but, as Jeff wrote, the people were very friendly and seemed to be happy!
Naturally, the further you get from the coast, the cheaper the prices. I visited Frigiliana (number 17 in the list in my previious post) when I was in Nerja. It is very picturesque but the houses for sale in my price range did not have garages and required climbing a lot to steps to get to.
earlyretirement
Moderator
Thanks for all the GREAT posts guys. I just sold two of my properties in Buenos Aires. I'm probably going to sell another so I want to put that money to work in another country as I enjoy real estate. I was thinking Southern Spain or maybe Mexico. I think there are some good arbitrage opportunities with the Mexican peso being so low. I looked at some properties in Guadalajara and they are in pesos so I think once Mexico has a recovery, there is some good $$$ to be made there.
Steve, funny you mention Frigiliana. Beautiful "white" city with tons of white buildings and some great views. Actually another friend lives there in that city. He pays really cheap rent there! I was amazed when I visited last year. Yes, the climbing the steps would be too much for me but if I had a car I could do it. Or maybe just a moped. Thanks for posting these links to real estate in Spain. I'm going to seriously take a look. The only thing is since the country has so many economic problems it seems like you can't charge too much for rent but I have some friends that may live abroad in Spain for a few years so it could work out nicely.
Does anyone on this forum own any real estate in Spain? (Sorry to go a bit off topic on this thread).
We own our property in Jerez de la Frontera - rental per week in high season (Semana Santa - end August) is approx. 1800 to 2500 euros per week for a well appointed 3+ bedroom property plus pool. Most rentals are to UK, Swedish and other EU countries. Our friends in San Lucar de Barrameda and Chiclana also rent out for higher prices per week as they are coastal and very popular with N Spanish tourists. The prettiest pueblos blancos also have a good rental market - can´t believe the top list that Steve posted didn´t include Medina Sidonia where our friends have a 3 acre finca with stunning views. If we didn´t have very active kids who need a garden and a pool I´d be living here...https://www.kyero.com/en/property/4094061-town-house-for-sale-medina-sidonia
earlyretirement
Moderator
Wow, I'm really amazed at the prices of some of these places. Seems like a good deal. I just saw this one - http://www.tucasa.com/compra-venta/...ga/marbella-municipio/elviria/?i=&id=20988445
Seems like a pretty good area and the place looks beautiful. I sold an 80 sq. meter 2 bedroom apartment in Buenos Aires for more than the cost of this place. I would just have to investigate what the rental market is like.
fifs2. Yes, I'd probably want to try to rent it out to foreigners via vacation rental. But I'd also have to see the restrictions in the properties. But looks like it's time to take a trip to Spain to look at some real estate.
Seems like a pretty good area and the place looks beautiful. I sold an 80 sq. meter 2 bedroom apartment in Buenos Aires for more than the cost of this place. I would just have to investigate what the rental market is like.
fifs2. Yes, I'd probably want to try to rent it out to foreigners via vacation rental. But I'd also have to see the restrictions in the properties. But looks like it's time to take a trip to Spain to look at some real estate.
I bought an apartment here in Cadiz in 2001. If you have any questions PM me.
earlyretirement
Moderator
Thanks Men! I just sent you a PM. But feel free to also answer here if you want and it can educate the mass forum.
My friend that is from Spain told me there is no big annual property tax each year. He said there is some tax but it's less than $500 US per year for the property/asset tax. I need to do some due diligence as I haven't started yet but it's always nice to hear from those that own properties and can give their real life experiences. He cautioned against long term rentals and said that it's hard to get a tenant out with their laws. But it's like that in Argentina as well but at least you can diminish your risk with getting a guarantor.
I'd be curious to hear what expenses are like (HOA, gas, water, electricity, cable/internet, etc). He said they were all fairly cheap.
Sorry Im British/Irish so cant comment on the US residence process. I can confirm there is a wealth tax - the first 700k euro are tax exempt.
Utilities aren´t cheap. Spanish electricity prices are some fo the highest in Europe https://www.spanishpropertyinsight.com/2016/06/06/cost-electricity-spain-high-eu-standards/
The bonus of the Andalucian climate and 50 average days of rain per year means you really only need heating Dec - Mar max. Some of the newer builds thrown up during the boom are of shocking poor quality. I´ve a friend whose house is mould ridden and freezing all winter. If you buy wisely and arent a friolero you can get by with an electric heater. Some data:
Water (for 59 days) - 285 euros July - Aug. We have a well but when it runs dry we water the garden daily (750 sqm). This was for 2386 m2 consumption
Electricity (for 59 days - 3 story house, 330 sqm, pool Dec - Jan) - 512 euros for 1,947 kilowatts consumption
Gas - we have gas central heating + cooking - 8 large bottles every winter - approx 330 euros
Fibre optic internet+phone package - approx. 200 euros per month
ABN equivalent - 1250 per year daily bin collections on street, quarterly grass cutting + weekly street cleaning
Hope that helps. Narrow down a city or town and then start to look into exact and current costs. Food across the board is ludicrously cheap, embarrassingly so. Breakfast this morning for 3 adults - 4.95 (3 coffees, mollete tostado each - that´s a long roll for the Bsas folk!)
earlyretirement
Moderator
This is really helpful. True, that people can google and find other forums but after reading this forum for many years, you kind of come to trust some of the personalities on this forum (others not so much... ha ha).
I totally agree about the ridiculous cost of food there. My family and I (wife and 3 kids) dined out at some great restaurants in/near Marbella and even with tons of food, drinks, etc. it was extremely cheap. And the food was amazingly good. Groceries in the market were a fraction of what we spend here in the USA in California. Definitely will look you up on our next trip to Spain. Thanks again for the helpful information.
earlyretirement
Moderator
Yep. I moved out of Buenos Aires in 2011 as I saw the writing on the wall of crazy inflation that probably wouldn't end for a while. While I think Macri is a huge improvement over CFK, and has implemented some good ideas..... he inherited a HUGE mess that will take several years to work itself out. The reality is that the people there probably don't have the patience to see it all through as it will take many years.
I had friends back then that said they would wait and see how things turned out. Most of them have also moved out. The ones that haven't are seriously considering it and putting their places on the market. What's helping several is they bought PH's or houses so they have no condo bills to deal with. That's a real savior as in most buildings the HOA fees are outrageous for what you actually get.
I still like to visit, but I can't see moving back there anytime soon. Just too many other wonderful places around the world with high quality of life, better cost of living, etc.
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