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Travel Re-entering Argentina at EZE after exceeding 180-day cap for tourists
- Thread starter Frisel
- Start date
Nothing happened because I always fly out of Argentina after 4-6 weeks, so I have never exceeded 90 days in one stay. But, over that past 12 months I have exceeded 180 days in Argentina and I thought I read here that 180 days was the max for a tourist.
I was in the process of doing the Radex permanent residency application via my Argentinian-born son but stopped after I became worried it would generate a tax event for my company if Argentina determined that a foreign company was employing an Argentinian resident.
If there’s been no overstay then you’re rolling the dice with the odds heavily in your favor.
The risk is that a particularly nasty officer starts doing the math and decides you are a de facto resident abusing the tourist mechanism.
Even then, the fact that you can show that you are working on permanent residence should probably help for some while.
Long-term this is probably untenable.
Serious question: can you simply create not plausible but actual deniability for your company, by not telling them you have become a permanent resident?
They hired a US citizen with a US address, your work is distance work, do they have to know that you are in Argentina?
If ever an issue comes up (extremely unlikely as long as you stay off AFIP’s radar and keep your paycheck coming to your US account), why cross that bridge when you get to it?
The risk is that a particularly nasty officer starts doing the math and decides you are a de facto resident abusing the tourist mechanism.
Even then, the fact that you can show that you are working on permanent residence should probably help for some while.
Long-term this is probably untenable.
Serious question: can you simply create not plausible but actual deniability for your company, by not telling them you have become a permanent resident?
They hired a US citizen with a US address, your work is distance work, do they have to know that you are in Argentina?
If ever an issue comes up (extremely unlikely as long as you stay off AFIP’s radar and keep your paycheck coming to your US account), why cross that bridge when you get to it?
I can tell my employer I am working from home in Los Angeles, somewhere else in the US, or somewhere else in the world (they cleared a couple of other countries that have tax treaties with the US) and there is no reason they would ever know I was in Argentina...UNLESS, somehow I got onto AFIP's radar and they realized they could create a huge taxable event in favor of Argentina and went after my company. And then of course I would most definitely get fired.
I would love to just get permanent residency in Argentina so I don't have to worry about exceeding the 180-day rule and I can get a DNI so I can buy a car, but won't doing so immediately put me on AFIP's radar? I am an American that is somehow able to live in Argentina without employment...I must be generating income somehow, and they will want a piece of it? Quick google search of my name would reveal my employer and its deep pockets.
earlyretirement
Moderator
Personally I would just get your DNI if you can. People are always worried about Argentina going after worldwide assets but I can tell you AFIP is a big cluster*ck. They don't even know what is going on in their own country. I'm not sure I'd worry too much about that vs. never being able to enter Argentina again.
Really you probably won't come on their radar unless you are opening accounts there, spending money, etc. For what you are doing (i.e. having NO bank accounts there, no trackable financial transactions that originate in Argentina, no spending on a local Argentine credit card) I wouldn't worry about coming on their radar and just do whatever you need to do to legally stay in the country large periods of time without the possibility of never being to enter again.
As far as your company, I don't think they would say anything if you didn't say you were in Argentina. Would they even know where you are?
Really you probably won't come on their radar unless you are opening accounts there, spending money, etc. For what you are doing (i.e. having NO bank accounts there, no trackable financial transactions that originate in Argentina, no spending on a local Argentine credit card) I wouldn't worry about coming on their radar and just do whatever you need to do to legally stay in the country large periods of time without the possibility of never being to enter again.
As far as your company, I don't think they would say anything if you didn't say you were in Argentina. Would they even know where you are?
Problem is that the consequences are FAR worse if I were to show upon AFIP's radar. If they went after my company for fines/taxes/etc I would lose my job. Whereas if I get kicked out of Argentina...well there is always Uruguay!
I don't understand how I won't show up on their radar as a result of getting a DNI. Aren't they going to wonder why this permanent resident has not paid a dime in taxes for the privilege of residing in Argentina?
I don't understand how I won't show up on their radar as a result of getting a DNI. Aren't they going to wonder why this permanent resident has not paid a dime in taxes for the privilege of residing in Argentina?
earlyretirement
Moderator
You are assuming that Argentina is very organized and structured. You have to understand how chaotic it is there. The right hand typically doesn't know what the left hand is doing there. I have many, many, many wealthy friends there and they have limited activity in Argentina banking. (i.e. they don't have big amounts in their bank accounts there. Just enough to pay bills, they don't use their Argentine credit cards much, they declare limited/low income on paper, etc). They own multiple properties yet they stay under the radar with AFIP.
It's funny because some of my best friends there asked me if I could get an additional credit card in the USA. In the USA you can easily get an authorized card and you don't have to supply any Social Security #. So they just use that to buy anything/everything and they just pay me cash. I think many locals must employ similar type options. In this way, they stay under the radar with AFIP because they can't see ANY of their purchases. Your situation really isn't any different.
I think you're mistakenly comparing it to the USA or first world countries where everything is structured and the IRS easily can see if you aren't reporting income, etc. It's NOT like that at all in Argentina. It's a chaotic mess so that's the last thing I'd worry about if you're worried about that.
Just do what you're doing and don't open up bank accounts locally, don't show any financial activity. I have lots of American friends that got DNI's there with NO local financial activity and successfully stayed under AFIP's radar and they own multiple properties. No problem at all.
In the USA, even if one client pays me and issues a 1099 and I forget to declare it. Or I have interest income from a bank and I forget to declare it, I automatically get a letter from the IRS. In the past 20 years I've gotten audited from the IRS 5 times. (Granted I own multiple companies and have multiple sources of income). But in Argentina there is systemic black market activity where everyone pays under the table, a large % of employees are in the black, etc. The last thing AFIP is going to worry about is one gringo that has a DNI that doesn't have ANY financial activity in Argentina. That shouldn't be a concern whatsoever for you.
Out of all my friends/clients that have DNI's, NONE of them have any local banking activity and they have NEVER had any problems with AFIP. And this dates back to 2002 when I started buying real estate there.
I'm not saying you should get a DNI but really if you are spending THAT much time there I really can't see a big downside to getting a DNI there. People always throw out the "but Argentina taxes you on worldwide assets". I always respond, but they don't even know what's going on in THEIR country. Fat chance they will know what's going on outside Argentina. And especially now that CFK will come back in power, countries like the USA will NOT be close to Argentina.
CFK will also probably go back to applying to visas for Americans, restricting banking activities, and other anti-American schemes so I think more than ever it would be good to get a DNI while it's relatively easy. JMHO.
earlyretirement
Moderator
Exactly as these guys said. No, no one I know had anyone ask what they were going to do there so it's as these guys said. Unless something changed I wouldn't worry about it.
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