Politics The Case For President Sergio Massa

[RemptilGuy]

For those who fear a Milei or Bullrich Presidency, let's hear why Sergio Massa would be the best choice for Argentina.

I don't believe this to be the case, but I'll start to get the discussion going.

Let's keep this to as why Massa is the best, and not about Bullrich or Milei who are pretty well covered on this thread - https://baexpats.org/threads/what-would-dollarization-mean-for-expats.46122/

Potential advantages to a Massa presidency:

1. He doesn't have a fixed ideology and may be open to practical solutions.
2. He's been in politics forever. He knows all the power brokers and would be more effective dealing with the Argentine bureaucracy than a newcomer like Milei.
3. He values security and even hired Rudy Guilani to consult on making Tigre more secure as a mayor of Tigre.
4. He has a long relationship with the US and will be able to negotiate with them effectively. He was mentioned in Wikileaks several times as being a source of information for the US Embassy.
5. If there is an economic crisis he will have support of unions and social groups more than Milei and Bullrich, limiting the potential social fallout - protests, strikes.

 

[RonnieHot]

6. Maintaining the status quo means expats with foreign income can continue to enjoy a high standard of living, whilst not suffering many of the negatives that the local population have to endure.

 

[Setse]

Massa is as milquetoast as alberto, so, if you value keeping things as they are in the country then he is your guy

 

[earlyretirement]

Nope. Would never vote for him.

 

[TemonNow]

Massa does not have an ideology. He is there, because he wants to be in power. Such people are dangerous as well. He will do what is best for him, not what is best for the country.

 

[QuiloBa]

The problem as I see it, is that the maintaining the status quo is not a viable choice. So I don’t see how one could vote for Massa.

 

[earlyretirement]

Massa does not have an ideology. He is there, because he wants to be in power. Such people are dangerous as well. He will do what is best for him, not what is best for the country.

Exactly correct. Most of these Presidents don't give a sh*t about the people. It's all about them. Milei with all his quirks actually comes across to people as caring about them. About really wanting to change things. A new beginning. He gives them hope. That's why he is ahead in the polls. Hope is a powerful thing.

 

[QuiloBa]

Exactly correct. Most of these Presidents don't give a sh*t about the people. It's all about them. Milei with all his quirks actually comes across to people as caring about them. About really wanting to change things. A new beginning. He gives them hope. That's why he is ahead in the polls. Hope is a powerful thing.

I think this is what's so powerful about him. Even if I despise him and don't believe his schtick for a minute, he resonates with people because he's not like Massa, saying everything is basically fine, and he's not like Bullrich, who talks about reform, he's the "let's blow the entire system up, and you can have ice cream for dinner" candidate, which is very different from what everyone else is offering.

I'm confident he'll disappoint people like everyone else has, but he's flashy and new, and that's attractive to people who basically feel they have nothing to lose.

Massa on the other hand is spineless, and won't even use the tools at his disposal to try and make himself president. In the hard K wing, folks like Kelly Olmos were saying that businesses that don't pay the bonuses Massa announced would be fined in addition to having to pay them anyways, yet Massa is now refusing to put that in the DNU, so it's just words, and now you have something like 17 provinces refusing to pay the bonus to state employees too, so again, people see promises not being delivered in real time.

Even if you don't think this was a good idea, the man should at least have the balls to stand by his word, otherwise don't waste peoples time, you're just confirming exactly what Bullrich and Milei accuse you of.

 

[earlyretirement]

I think this is what's so powerful about him. Even if I despise him and don't believe his schtick for a minute, he resonates with people because he's not like Massa, saying everything is basically fine, and he's not like Bullrich, who talks about reform, he's the "let's blow the entire system up, and you can have ice cream for dinner" candidate, which is very different from what everyone else is offering.

I'm confident he'll disappoint people like everyone else has, but he's flashy and new, and that's attractive to people who basically feel they have nothing to lose.

Massa on the other hand is spineless, and won't even use the tools at his disposal to try and make himself president. In the hard K wing, folks like Kelly Olmos were saying that businesses that don't pay the bonuses Massa announced would be fined in addition to having to pay them anyways, yet Massa is now refusing to put that in the DNU, so it's just words, and now you have something like 17 provinces refusing to pay the bonus to state employees too, so again, people see promises not being delivered in real time.

Even if you don't think this was a good idea, the man should at least have the balls to stand by his word, otherwise don't waste peoples time, you're just confirming exactly what Bullrich and Milei accuse you of.

Amen. That's what I like about him. Even people that don't like him or prefer the other party, they respect his approach and understand why the guy is getting traction. The youth don't give a sh*t about anything else. I have tons of friends there and they are desperate. MANY have already moved to Spain. If you go to a city like Malaga it's absolutely packed with Argentines that have escaped to a better life.

They weren't looking to get rich. They aren't making much money. They never will. But you know what they have???? STABILITY. They have a job that pays them in Euros that is stable. They don't have to worry that tomorrow there will be double digit inflation and they will have to sheepishly go to their boss and ask for ANOTHER raise/loan every day. They can feed their kids. It's safe and they are content just to have a normal life where they know tomorrow things will continue to go on like the day before. They do NOT have that situation in Argentina.

They weren't looking for some exotic place where they can have fun. F*?* fun. They just want to subsist. They just want to know they have a decent place to rent and when the lease ends it won't go up 125% and there will be 0 rents for them available. Because that's the situation in Argentina with the moronic leaders in place.

In Argentina NO political party can pretend things are ok. That's why Massa and Bullrich can't win. They play along like things will be ok. That THIS time it will be difficult. You know what? It won't be different this time.

Even with Milei things will be really tough. But at least people are ready for a change. I moved to Argentina after the last financial crash in 2002. I fell in love with the country but the longer I lived there the less hope I had for systemic change until finally I left as I didn't want to raise my kids in a society that was essentially hopeless. I know I'll probably never see systemic change in Argentina in my life time. But at least with Milei I think he can put the train on the tracks so my kids might see systemic change in Argentina.

 

[RemptilGuy]

Much of the opposition to Milei is the fear of increased cost of living for expats. Not his love of tantric sex, dogs or unusual closeness with his sister.

With Massa, nothing changes, which isn't a bad thing for expats living on dollars. Vamos Massa!

 

[earlyretirement]

Much of the opposition to Milei is the fear of increased cost of living for expats. Not his love of tantric sex, dogs or unusual closeness with his sister.

With Massa, nothing changes, which isn't a bad thing for expats living on dollars. Vamos Massa!

I'd say screw ex-pats if all they care about is a cheap steak. It does no good everything around them is burning and people are so desperate. Desperate people do bad things.

Many ex-pats contribute very little to local society. They don't pay taxes, don't want to get DNI, etc. Anyone that truly loves Argentina wants to see systemic change and Milei is the best route towards that.

 

[QuiloBa]

I'd say screw ex-pats if all they care about is a cheap steak. It does no good everything around them is burning and people are so desperate. Desperate people do bad things.

Many ex-pats contribute very little to local society. They don't pay taxes, don't want to get DNI, etc. Anyone that truly loves Argentina wants to see systemic change and Milei is the best route towards that.

Hold on, let's not go too far with this tax business. Expat consumption alone is helpful, to say nothing of that fact that so many of you are economic engines for the country, encouraging visitors.

 

[earlyretirement]

Hold on, let's not go too far with this tax business. Expat consumption alone is helpful, to say nothing of that fact that so many of you are economic engines for the country, encouraging visitors.

Oh absolutely I'm not saying Ex-pats don't contribute and help out with spending. I guess my only point is that overall I think they get more then they give. If you know what I mean. Argentina is a wonderful place for them. Life in the USA is pretty shitty without spending a small fortune.

 

[NormanTadeo]

I agree that expats get more than they give. If they gave more than they got, they'd go some place else. And the choices for expats aren't simply here or back home...many countries to choose from.

Flip the table around. Argentina benefits from expats. The get more than they give as well. Expats, just as tourists and exports to overseas customers all bring money into the national economy from elsewhere.

Money into the system benefits Argentina.

If it wasn't a win/win relationship...it would be happening.

Oh absolutely I'm not saying Ex-pats don't contribute and help out with spending. I guess my only point is that overall I think they get more then they give. If you know what I mean. Argentina is a wonderful place for them. Life in the USA is pretty shitty without spending a small fortune.

 

[earlyretirement]

Definitely I agree with you it's a win/win. Buenos Aires is THE best city in the world for digital nomads and expats. No question at all. I've been to over 500+ cities around the world and counting. There is no place like Argentina. God bless Argentina.

 

[RealLit]

I'd say screw ex-pats if all they care about is a cheap steak. It does no good everything around them is burning and people are so desperate. Desperate people do bad things.

Many ex-pats contribute very little to local society. They don't pay taxes, don't want to get DNI, etc. Anyone that truly loves Argentina wants to see systemic change and Milei is the best route towards that.

We bring our money here and spend it. That looks like contributing to me.