Economy Argentina isn't the affordable option

[Ross]

Yes, it's very cheap in Argentina. Even if Argentina ever could truly dollarize (I don't see that happening anytime soon). It won't be expensive like it was before.

I'm not sure if Argentina is cheaper than Bangkok. I was just there not long ago and it was very very very very cheap. If it weren't for the horrible hot and humid weather it would be great. I took a family of 5 to eat a delicious and fresh meal and it was only around $20 US. No where even in Buenos Aires you can eat that cheap. Some places like Terminal 21 upstairs in the food court where you had fabulous food that was really fresh we had meals for as low as $12 for the 5 of us.

Things like 1 hour massage in Bangkok (and much of Thailand) I was paying $6 US per hour. In Buenos Aires I pay $10 per hour at a comparable place.

In Buenos Aires at most places were were still spending on average about $70 US dollars for the 5 of us by the time you added up appetizers, main entre, drinks and dessert.

Some of these places this guy is saying are affordable, aren't really that affordable. Colombia isn't really cheap. And he mentions Cali which is a complete DUMP. No one would want to live there. Colombia things are expensive. Food isn't too cheap, electricty is expensive. He mentions Cartagena which is way overpriced. I find most cities in Colombia to be a dump.

Argentina is VERY cheap and the quality of life is amazing here. Especially Buenos Aires. NOT a place to live if you have to make money here but if RETIREMENT is where you want to live, I don't think it gets any better. I've been to over 575+ cities around the world. About 125 countries. Buenos Aires is amazing to retire to.

You keep hitting coincidences for me! Just as I plan to fly to Bangkok in a couple of weeks, you provoke a thread full of useful information about Bangkok

 

[earlyretirement]

You keep hitting coincidences for me! Just as I plan to fly to Bangkok in a couple of weeks, you provoke a thread full of useful information about Bangkok

Great Ross! We are on the same "wavelength" lately. You will love Bangkok. We really loved Thailand and eager to go back this summer. The people are so kind and gentile.

 

[Ross]

Great Ross! We are on the same "wavelength" lately. You will love Bangkok. We really loved Thailand and eager to go back this summer. The people are so kind and gentile.

Super impressed with your 125 countries too. I hope to get there one day. I’m on 42 countries but still in my twenties so plenty of time to catch up!

 

[hunt]

Thank for that really detailed explanation on Bangkok. This is why I love these forums. The sharing of valuable information. Yes, when I looked at apartment rental prices on long term rentals in Bangkok, I saw some nice ones for about $500 US per month which more or less matches what you're saying. I looked at 1 bedroom units.

Yes, I ate in Siam Paragon and MBK too and you're exactly correct. Those places were about double or 2.5 X the price of Terminal 21. You mentioned they are trying to attract tourists but we went there for 4 days in a row and I mostly saw locals not tourists eating there. A local explained to me they make it cheap so locals don't cook and just eat out. I don't understand why anyone would cook if they can get delicious food like that for so cheap. We had many dishes at Terminal 21 and the proteins and vegetables were super fresh and delicious. We tried many stalls and most were less than $2 US per person. It was unbelievable. And I'm not talking super small portion. Enough food to fill you up.

I really appreciate your detailed prices on Bangkok and I find it's spot on target. I stayed at the Hyatt Regency and I'm a Globalist. They upgraded us to a HUGE suite. They had free dinner at night in the Club Lounge but we only went up there for the wine, as you noted it's not cheap there. But I refused to eat there Free as food was so delicious and cheap in Terminal 21 a few blocks away. However, the breakfast was AMAZING at the Hyatt Regency. One of the best in all my travels around the world. The French Toast was incredible.

My kids were in heaven deciding all the stalls to eat at. We never had a bad meal in Bangkok and really all of Thailand. I love your country. We visited Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Koh Samui, Phuket. I fell in love with your culture and people there.

Just out of curiosity, what brought you to Buenos Aires? Which do you like better? The only thing I didn't like about Bangkok was the horrible heat and humidity. I couldn't stand that all the time. Also, the traffic is pretty horrendous. I didn't use the public transport as I had a driver.

I have a 2-bedroom 55 sq. m. apartment in BKK with nice gym, club house and 50m infinity pool and the rent I saw at the real estate agent downstairs is only around $430-500 (this is post-covid. Pre-covid, a friend of mine rented a room this size next to my room and it cost him $570-700). Fortunately for tourists, BKK has an oversupply of apartments or what we normally call "condominiums" (apartment for us is more like a no-frill studio room without any amenities like gym, pool etc and it is much cheaper than condo that's for sure) and that makes the rental price very competitive and it got even cheaper due to covid. I've compared notes with some people here regarding the depto selling price and it seems like it's relatively similar to the price in BKK but it all depends on what barrio I suppose. Mind you, BKK has some very fancy condos like a small room sized 30 sq. m. could cost $200,000+ depending on the area. Normally the expensive ones are within the walking distance to the skytrain (BTS) and subway (MRT) or by the river.
About locals not cooking, most of us don't cook anyway. It costs only $1-2 for a meal so it's cheaper and more convenient to eat out or buy something to go. I cook because I love cooking and I only cooked on the weekend when I was living in BKK. Weekdays after work I just bought dinner on the way home from my office. I always saw a good mix of locals and foreigners at Terminal 21 food court and it was always busy and a challenge to find a seat and since it's so cheap, I suppose it attracts local tourists too. I did go there to eat sometimes if I happened to pass through the area.
If you stay at a nice hotel like 4* up like the Hyatt, breakfast is always amazing. They give you a variety of local and western choices plus Chinese and Japanese options. I went to Iguazu last month and the hotel was nice too (Mercure) but the breakfast was just OK. I find breakfast at hotels in Argentina heavy on sweet baked goods like 80% on those and the rest is hot food and others. I'm more of a hot food kind of guy when it comes to breakfast.
The heat is BKK can be brutal. You get used to it or you can manage it if you live there. That's why everywhere is airconditioned and Thais like to go to shopping malls as it's nice and cool. Only Europeans stay out in the sun or tan themselves which is understandable especially if they come from Scandinavia where it's always dark in the winter. We don't do that and we try to stay away from the sun as much as we can. We use umbrellas to walk in the sun.
The traffic can be very bad and it has always been that way for a long time. But now there are skytrain, subway and airport rail link so I normally utilize all those to avoid traffic. And if I need to go somewhere really quickly during rush hour, we have motorcycle taxi for that Sukhumvit road is probably the most traffic congested road in BKK and that's where you stayed. That's why you were stuck in traffic. I'd never drive on Sukhumvit since the BTS runs through the entire road. I suggest only use the driver when you go outside of the city center. It's faster and easier to go around with BTS and MRT.

 

[dandy]

About Bankok, personally I couldn't endure the hot, humid weather in Bangkok. BA is bad enough. Is local cooking very salty like Japanese food? I can't eat high sodium food.

 

[earlyretirement]

Super impressed with your 125 countries too. I hope to get there one day. I’m on 42 countries but still in my twenties so plenty of time to catch up!

Well it's taken traveling about 100 days each year every year for the past 20 years. Even with 3 kids we try to instill in our children the importance of getting around to see other cultures and how others live. Different religions, different foods, transportation and way of life.

I told myself when I was in my 20's I would do this and make it a part of my kid's lives. Thankfully my wife had the same approach and it's changed the way they look at the world.

Too many people (especially Americans) think their world is the center of the universe and don't know how the rest of the world lives. It's amazing to travel around. Congrats to you Jtee125. Keep it up!

I was telling my wife the other day I'm not sure if my kids even appreciate how lucky they are to travel. We did It since they were newborns so it comes second nature to them. But then my oldest daughter (15 years old) shocked me when she was doing her homework and she read this to me.

It made me extremely happy!

She wrote:


"In my family, traveling has always been a very important part of our lives and identities. Even from a young age I had been to many countries and got to visit diverse cultures, religions, and lifestyles.
Learning the customs and daily practices of different countries from a young age is something that I will always cherish. My dad traveled a lot when he was younger and he believes it's a significant part of him to this day, so he wanted me to have the same experiences and opportunities.

I'm so grateful for having a family where traveling is so important because getting to know the world is something that not everyone has the chance to do. Many Americans never leave their country, and this leads them to believe that the whole world is similar to the U.S. but it's not.

Every country around the world is so unique from one another. Transportation, food, behavior, and even things found in the store are so distinct from the U.S. Traveling has changed me so much and how I grew up because I've seen different aspects of the world. It has opened my eyes to see other cultures but has also shown me how lucky I am to live in the United States and have all the resources and support I need. My traveling experiences contribute to a rich and genuine perspective of the world today, but I also have a stronger connection with my family. It is seen as a time to escape reality and spend time together. My favorite memories growing up have always been traveling."

 

[hunt]

About Bankok, personally I couldn't endure the hot, humid weather in Bangkok. BA is bad enough. Is local cooking very salty like Japanese food? I can't eat high sodium food.

No. That food isn't that salty. It's a balance of sweet, sour, salty and of course spicy but it depends on the dish. Some places make it on the sweet side but I don't like that. Things that are supposed to be sweet yeah can be sweet but when they make things that are not supposed to be sweet sweet, I just don't go back.
I understand what you mean when you say the food is salty in Japan. I ate ramen there and felt like I needed a dialysis afterwards. The same goes for some chorizo here. A few days I bought salchicha parillera from Coto and it was like eating pure salt. Why is it so salty?

 

[earlyretirement]

No. That food isn't that salty. It's a balance of sweet, sour, salty and of course spicy but it depends on the dish. Some places make it on the sweet side but I don't like that. Things that are supposed to be sweet yeah can be sweet but when they make things that are not supposed to be sweet sweet, I just don't go back.
I understand what you mean when you say the food is salty in Japan. I ate ramen there and felt like I needed a dialysis afterwards. The same goes for some chorizo here. A few days I bought salchicha parillera from Coto and it was like eating pure salt. Why is it so salty?

My next trip to Buenos Aires we have to meet up for lunch. (My treat). I completely agree with everything you are saying. I'd think you'd really miss your food from your homeland. I find Thai food to be delicious and flavorful. It has the right amount and balance of sweet, salt and spices. I can't handle really spicy but I found just asking them to tone it down was enough. Food isn't mass produced there. It seemed like everything is made fresh each and every time we went somewhere. We were in Thailand 3 weeks all over the country and everywhere we went was awesome.

The only thing I disagree is I LOVE Chorizo. Some are too salty but the higher end places like Don Julio or La Cabrera it's delicious. Even cheap places like Chori over in Palermo Soho I really love. Now you guys are making me hungry.

 

[hunt]

My next trip to Buenos Aires we have to meet up for lunch. (My treat). I completely agree with everything you are saying. I'd think you'd really miss your food from your homeland. I find Thai food to be delicious and flavorful. It has the right amount and balance of sweet, salt and spices. I can't handle really spicy but I found just asking them to tone it down was enough. Food isn't mass produced there. It seemed like everything is made fresh each and every time we went somewhere. We were in Thailand 3 weeks all over the country and everywhere we went was awesome.

The only thing I disagree is I LOVE Chorizo. Some are too salty but the higher end places like Don Julio or La Cabrera it's delicious. Even cheap places like Chori over in Palermo Soho I really love. Now you guys are making me hungry.

Well, let me know when you come to CABA and let's do lunch. Don't get me wrong. Chorizo at all the parillas that I normally order for appetizer is always delicious and not salty and I normally don't buy chorizo at Coto but a few days I wanted to try and I was disappointed. It felt like half the ingredients was salt. I'll try carniceria and see what happens.

 

[Quirno]

It's interesting to note the frequent mention of Thailand here; it's one of the places I've visited where, aside from the humidity, I could envision myself living, had I not gotten married and settled down.

In my personal experience, I've found Buenos Aires to be more affordable than Bangkok for most things, even though I prefer the food in Thailand. I'd be willing to pay more here if it meant having access to fresh and spicy gai pad med mamuang. Having been fortunate enough to travel to about 50 countries, I remain convinced that when it comes to balancing quality of life and cost of living, Buenos Aires is hard to beat, especially if you earn or have savings in dollars.

 

[earlyretirement]

Well, let me know when you come to CABA and let's do lunch. Don't get me wrong. Chorizo at all the parillas that I normally order for appetizer is always delicious and not salty and I normally don't buy chorizo at Coto but a few days I wanted to try and I was disappointed. It felt like half the ingredients was salt. I'll try carniceria and see what happens.

Ah yes, I actually never buy Chorizo in the supermarket. Food is so cheap in the restaurants and so delicious I'm usually eating out for breakfast, lunch and dinner every day when I'm there.

When I lived in Buenos Aires I lived on Avenida Alvear between Callao and Rodriguez Pena. I ate at Sotto Voce probably 3 X a week. I love dining out. I mostly ate at home when my Porteño friends would invite me for dinner which was at least once a week.

 

[Travis]

I have a preference for Mexican chorizo, especially in dishes like chorizo con huevos. There's a spot in Barrio Logan, San Diego, right next to Chicano Park under the Coronado Bridge, called Las Cuatro Milpas. They serve chorizo with beans in a style that I've been told is typical of southern Mexico, and it's absolutely delicious. They accompany it with this salsa featuring red oil on the top that's akin to a liquid tonsillectomy. Ah, memories of San Diego... Mostly, I just find myself longing for Mexican cuisine.

 

[earlyretirement]

I have a preference for Mexican chorizo, especially in dishes like chorizo con huevos. There's a spot in Barrio Logan, San Diego, right next to Chicano Park under the Coronado Bridge, called Las Cuatro Milpas. They serve chorizo with beans in a style that I've been told is typical of southern Mexico, and it's absolutely delicious. They accompany it with this salsa featuring red oil on the top that's akin to a liquid tonsillectomy. Ah, memories of San Diego... Mostly, I just find myself longing for Mexican cuisine.

Ha, I used to go there all the time but the line was so long. It is good but I go down to Mexico all the time as I own several properties there. The food in Puebla can't be beat! Mexican food is the best. San Diego is the BEST city to live in the USA. It's where I live. But it's God awful expensive here. But for raising kids it doesn't get any better.

 

[Kenib]

Perhaps I should kickstart my gai pad med mamuang business here—haha. I've noticed an abundance of cashews at Coto, so there shouldn't be a shortage, and chicken is quite affordable. Interestingly, I've been preparing meals every day, but oddly enough, chicken cashew nuts haven't been on the menu since I moved here. Thanks for sparking that idea!

 

[earlyretirement]

It's interesting to note the frequent mention of Thailand here; it's one of the places I've visited where, aside from the humidity, I could envision myself living, had I not gotten married and settled down.

In my personal experience, I've found Buenos Aires to be more affordable than Bangkok for most things, even though I prefer the food in Thailand. I'd be willing to pay more here if it meant having access to fresh and spicy gai pad med mamuang. Having been fortunate enough to travel to about 50 countries, I remain convinced that when it comes to balancing quality of life and cost of living, Buenos Aires is hard to beat, especially if you earn or have savings in dollars.

Great minds think alike. It's amazing to see Thailand mentioned and to even have someone from Thailand that moved to Buenos Aires. I think that's a testament to how wonderful Buenos Aires is. Like you Quilombo, I could easily live in Thailand if not for the humidity. My kids and my wife also loved it. Even with the humidity, I think I could send a few months a year there just for the amazing food. I found the food there amongst the best and cheapest in the world. So flavorful and so many varieties.

I do agree that quality of life in Buenos Aires is just about as good as it gets anywhere. I've been to over 550+ cities and counting and I have yet to find a better overall city when you factor in cultural events, beautiful architecture, weather, safety. quality of life, restaurants, things to do. I think the people are FAR nicer and friendlier in Thailand vs. Buenos Aires. Actually I don't think the people are that friendly in Buenos Aires compared to the majority of South America. For years, Argentines had an attitude and most still think they are "European" vs. the South Americans that they are.

This economic mess has kind of put them in their place. I want to see it do better but as I've always said, I think systemic change is just about impossible unless they blow up many of their existing laws and restructure. An an ideal world, either a country invades them (which I realize won't happen) or they sell themselves to a wealthy country and agree to start ALL over with their laws, and framework. It's really the only way I see systemic change happening.

Still, as messed ups a country as it is. You can live a pretty damn good life there as long as you make $US and spend in pesos. I don't see it changing any time soon.

Perhaps I should kickstart my gai pad med mamuang business here—haha. I've noticed an abundance of cashews at Coto, so there shouldn't be a shortage, and chicken is quite affordable. Interestingly, I've been preparing meals every day, but oddly enough, chicken cashew nuts haven't been on the menu since I moved here. Thanks for sparking that idea!

Actually Chinatown has dramatically gotten better there. It's amazing how much it's grown in a relatively short amount of time. But most of the restaurants still aren't that good there. I'd never open a restaurant there. But if you do, I'll gladly be a customer!

 

[earlyretirement]

Greetings! Indeed, I've dined at Terminal 21, but the food didn't leave a lasting impression on me, although the prices were quite reasonable. More frequently, I opted for meals at Emporium, situated a bit further up Sukhumvit. However, the majority of my meals were sourced from street vendors in Lat Phrao, my place of residence, typically indulging in grilled chicken and sticky rice.

Choosing between Thailand and Buenos Aires is a tough call for me, but ultimately, the climate here takes the winning spot.

Ah yes we went to Emporium as well. We didn't eat in Lat Phrao but we did eat lots of grilled chicken and sticky rice. It was delicious. Some of the places in Terminal 21 weren't as good but what we did was looked where only locals were going. We did see some tourists but tons of locals were eating up in Terminal 21.

And they also had some really amazing restaurants from Singapore in Terminal 21 as well. A Michelin starred restaurant that we go to in Singapore is called Hawker Chan and they even had one of those restaurants up there. One of our favorites and tough to get a Michelin star. Singapore has amazing cheap food as well.

I found Thailand to be a really beautiful country. I was amazed at the temples they had with gold, treasures that didn't even need to be guarded. In Argentina or anywhere else. Even the USA, everything would got robbed. But there it was such a respectful culture.

 

[earlyretirement]

This is why Argentina may not be a preferred retirement destination for many individuals. In contrast, Mexico actively encourages North Americans to retire there, boasting a more stable environment than Argentina. Notably, there are tens of thousands of Canadians and US citizens residing in expat hubs like San Miguel de Allende and Ajijic. These locales offer a lifestyle that provides the support of an active foreign community, which may not be as readily found in Argentina. In Argentina, a retiree must be more self-reliant, willing to learn Spanish, and integrate into the local culture. Moreover, they must be adaptable to the inevitable shifts in the economy and political landscape. While some may find this exhilarating, those seeking a tranquil, warm climate and peace of mind might find greater happiness elsewhere.

I'd totally disagree with you about it not being a desirable retirement destination for most people. Many people do NOT want to hang out with others that don't speak the native language. I find cities like San Miguel and Ajijic kind of disgusting. Not In the sense they are not beautiful. Because they are. I know those two cities well and have friends that retired there. I have MANY that I know that moved to Chapala and Ajijic. But they learned Spanish and really involved with the community. But many from Canada or USA that go there never even bother to learn Spanish which I find obscene, rude and wouldn't want to hang out with them.

Even on this board there are probably a lot of people that have lived in Buenos Aires years and still don't speak Spanish. I find that disgusting. I've only met a few people on this board in real life. One of them is "Chris" who I met many, many, many years ago. A perfect gentleman that loves Argentina as much as I do. It was great to see him again in La Biela just a few weeks ago. He is the type of guy that I'd want to be friends with in real life.

"Stable" is a relative term. It's very subjective. Why do I want to hang out with "thousands of other expats"? That's not what retired life is about for many of us. What "active foreign community" does a retired person need? LOL.

I kind of laugh when I read posts like this talking about "stable". Many retired in the USA can't even afford to buy groceries now! Do you know how much gas is or healthcare? Not being able to pay for food on the table is NOT "stabile" so I think we have subjective terms of quality of life in retirement.

From my experience, most retirees want a place that is relatively safe, affordable, great cultural activities, decent weather, ability to travel a bit from that destination. Buenos Aires and many areas in Argentina in general gives them that.

Some of you are making a bigger deal out of the "instability" of the locals. For true locals earning pesos it's NOT stable. But for you expats earning dollars you can't even dare talk about stability. Just my 2 cents.

 

[astronaut]

Turkey is the cheapest place to live? This guy doesn't know what he is talking about.

 

[Rico]

Thailand extends beyond just Bangkok, and it's surprising that no one has brought up the topic of entertainment in the country.

 

[earlyretirement]

Thailand extends beyond just Bangkok, and it's surprising that no one has brought up the topic of entertainment in the country.

What are you referring to entertainment? Are you referring to Pay 2 Play scene? I'm not into Asian girls at all and never will be. I also am married so I could care less about that "entertainment". If you're talking about other things, there was plenty of beautiful things to do in Thailand. I went all over Thailand and the country was really beautiful. Other than the weather, I think it would be a fine place to retire.

I've been all over South America to almost every country. And South America probably has as much "entertainment" as any other place. Buenos Aires used to be chock full of places like Madaho's, Black's, Hook's, Hippopotamus, Sodoma, Nuevo Estilo, Cutty Sark, Newport, Rio Cabaña, Play's, Secrets, Solid Gold. Checkers, Salome, and dozens of other places. There are still a few places around. But they are more discreet now. I knew the owners of all of those places back in the day. There are still as many girls doing that but everything has shifted over to WhatsApp. So much easier and like ordering a pizza.