Judging by the advice from all our Argentinean wives it sounds like they all think the same way. @Vince I got the same advice many years ago. I'm ok with just my USA passport. I'm not planning on releasing CIA files. 🤣
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Visas How complicated is it to obtain residency in Argentina?
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VINO
Well-known member
At least you have someone to join your initiative for a 2nd passport. It is a good idea for him.you should Google some links about the perks of having a second passport and citizenship - it's not just for whistleblowers and celebrities; there are myriad benefits. if you've already decided it's pointless for most people, then go about your business. but most Expats are already living a very unusual life from the 95% rest of the world, so inquiry into having multiple "flags" planted for political diversification is a very common thing for many decades now.
regarding Residency and DNI and Citizenship, i just noticed this thread on the old censored forum:
New DNI requirements, anyone got a walkthrough?
I'm very overwhelmed by all this. Went to the police station to get my partner's certificado, and suddenly they don't do that anymore. Do we still need the FBI background check? Can any of you expats be my witnesses? Anything else terrifying that I should know about this?baexpats.org
it's talking about how this year there were some changes, and maybe USA folks don't need an FBI check to get a DNI? and Police in CABA aren't doing Certificado De Domicilio anymore? anyone have any info on this?
fetch rover
Well-known member
I just read your other post about not wanting to pay your US taxes to the IRS. Understand your reasons for not wanting to pay but this goes back to what I mentioned, that probably most of the people that want second passports are criminals or breaking the law. Not paying the IRS is a crime. No judgments but you made my point about the 2nd passport issue.
I have not read any of those websites that you mentioned and I don't want to appear arrogant. I was just stating an opinion that seems to be correct in this case. Probably other good reasons to have a 2nd passport even though you have a very strong passport from the USA or UK but I would guess it is tax related.
StatusNomadicus
Well-known member
nope, just was asking the same, since the old censored forum talked about things not being required suddenly this year: "It's certificado de domicilio, and nope, the cops won't do it anymore."
i can vouch that in Mendoza Capital, the Registro Civil office closest to you will do these "domicile" change-of-address tasks for $3 USD. it is a crappy half-piece of paper that has a receipt glue-sticked to it, like a 7-year-old was making arts and crafts 😛
in Mendoza at the Civil Registry you just go to the Ventanilla Unica, get a number, pay for a "codigo" code, then tell them what your new address is. no witnesses, no police, do it all there and you leave with the paper, and it takes 30 minutes (i did this for both me and my girlfriend when we moved from Cordoba to Mendoza and needed to change Migraciones offices to here. in Cordoba i had to get the cops to write a Declaracion Jurada with 2 witnesses. very strange difference.
for the majority, but if you are planning to renounce your USA passport, or if you are trying to avoid massive taxes, or avoid a future draft, or you might get extradited someday, having 2 countries on "your side" might help. as i've mentioned before, Snowden would have never been trapped in Russia if he had 2 passports (though he probably woud never have gotten an NSA contractor job with 2 passports), and Julian Assange may not have been imprisoned for so many years if he had a second country's diplomats fighting for him.
the entire point of living as an Expat is to be flexible in geography. the political Plan B that i've mentioned on many threads is a simple concept, and is just like Food Storage: most people won't do it, but it's a good idea if you want to protect your family.
sure, but most people who are looking for 2nd passports are looking for those services (i'm more of a DIY guy).
keep in mind that almost all Upper Class and politicians and elites end up getting 2nd passports or more. there's a reason why they're doing it 🙂
agreed. and if they're in Argentina, they need to learn Spanish. i wouldn't recommend the DIY route to most people. maybe 25% of Expats could do it, and Expats are already like 5% of the general population.
another idiotic comment from a commie who thinks the world is simplified between evil greedy capitalists and the "good guys" who love paying taxes and are never disloyal to their political tribe. adding you to my Mute/Ignore list. it's interesting that you're so certain of your beliefs, yet you've never actually researched why normal people want multiple citizenships and passports. commie gonna commie
for the rest of the crowd here, with more than Orc intelligence, protecting your family with more options isn't because you're evil, or because you're going to be a criminal. nor are these companies evil for offering a service that saves you hundreds of hours:
it's a funny joke, but my point remains: having a Plan B for food/water storage, political freedom, geographical opportunities, aren't just for your Congress elites and criminals. i've met many many people in my travels with 2 citizenships, and they all maintain both passports for a reason.
for me, having a non-USA passport means once this Ukraine proxy war is over i might finally be able to see Moscow and Saint Petersburg. i don't want to die without seeing Russia for a couple weeks. i can't do this with my USA passport. that's 1 example out of a million. if you don't want a second passport, i don't really care, but the NPC arguments against it are as lame as calling someone who is against the latest war "unpatriotic" - the stuff you hear on the TV about second passports isn't reality. it's a very smart idea, and easier than ever with the internet.
look-into how many of the 1% and politicians have 2nd passports.
negatron, i've been a part of the US empire's war machine, and i am disgusted by the decline of my country. my Bitcoin is very much safe from the IRS (by design - they can blow me), but to attribute my desire for a "Plan B" as just greed is pretty lame when the USA is currently helping Netanyahu invade Lebanon, and killing thousands of Russians for no reason. i don't want to be part of evil. why guess? you can just ask me.
Betsy Ross
Well-known member
But my guess is once you get Citizenship here you probably won't be keen on paying tons of taxes to support all the Noquis and their causes.
I Love Mate
Member
I talked to an acquaintance today that said they heard from the immigration attorney Rubilar that the government was trying to make it tougher to get Citizenship here. I guess they are going to make it much more difficult to naturalize citizenship here. Does anyone have any information on this?
I think some have been trying to make it more difficult for a while with no success. Maybe with Milei it will change. Here is an article from back in August.
Abad propone la actualización de las condiciones para adquirir la ciudadanía
El senador nacional Maximiliano Abad (UCR) presentó un proyecto de ley para actualizar las condiciones y requisitos para adquirir la ciudadanía argentina, ya que “hoy es más f...
www.parlamentario.com
This Senator has been presented a bill to make it tougher. But I think they also tried in 2012 and 2022 too without success. I don't think there is anything wrong with what they are trying to change. Rather than just being 18 years old and living here 2 years they have to speak Spanish and also have enough money to live here.
That doesn't seem like a lot to ask but lots that move here don't learn Spanish and many don't make much money.
Probably a good way to scare people into using your services! I agree it can be complicated to get Citizenship here but it is in the USA or UK or most first world countries too. I don't think these new requirements are too much more difficult. Anyone living here or that wants citizenship should learn Spanish.
GraceHill
Member
On the background check what are they checking for? Is it only serious crimes? In college many years ago I got a DUI. Would Argentina care about that arrest and record?
The FBI background check is very extensive. It shows arrests and convictions. If it's not a conviction it will stay on your record for 7 years and then typically drops off if you weren't convicted. If you were arrested it will have all your details. DUI's are included on the FBI report. I had one too.
It didn't prevent me from getting residency here. I was worried about that too. The FBI background report even shows outstanding warrants, bankruptcies and I also had some traffic violations on it.
I was told that Argentine authorities arelooking for any criminal activity that might pose a risk to public safety or indicate a pattern of law-breaking behavior. A friend that was applying got arrested for DUI twice and he was rejected for residency. I think he had a few other arrests too.
My lawyer told me they will automatically ban for serious crimes like felonies, violent offenses, anything drug related, fraud, theft or assault. Anything that shows a pattern of criminal behavior regardless of the type of crime.
So in my case, my DNI didn't prevent me from getting it but my friend that had multiple DNI's was rejected.
The key is just to be honest on everything. I don't think they will care too much about a DUI but as mentioned if you have multiple then that probably would be a problem. I am not sure how much of this is the discretion of the person handling your case. Like anything in Argentina it could just be who is working on your case.
But always good to be upfront. I applied for my Global Entry and got denied. I forgot about an open container of alcohol ticket I got in college. It was a LONG time ago but they asked me about it and I said no and they rejected my Global Entry because of that. I honestly forgot about that ticket. The government has a record of everything.
How much did it cost you? I'm thinking about moving to Argentina in a few years, and still unsure of what to expect for the costs of moving and gaining residency.
Jakoval
Well-known member
I'm married to a native Argentine and we did all the procedures by ourselves so it only cost me some fees of translations, legalization of documents etc. Quite minimal. But the only thing that cost quite a lot was when I had to send my police clearance back to the Argentine embassy in my home country to get it legalized. That alone cost around 500 dollars (DHL round trip etc etc) There was no lawyer involved.
Betsy Ross
Well-known member
The entire Apostillization process was cumbersome. @te_rojo do as much as you can while you are in the USA. FBI fingerprint anything you need to get Apostillized. Just DHL'ing documents to Argentina was very expensive. Plus I don't know if they still require it but I had to get some documents translated and it was expensive.
You probably will need to hire an immigration attorney. It is difficult to do on your own if you are not married to an Argentine.
Jakoval
Well-known member
Just get all your docs legalized/apostilled before you come to Argentina. All the translations from English to Spanish must be done in Argentina by local certified translators. I didn't legalize my police clearance because the Argentine Embassy in Thailand was stupid (that specific guy) didn't want to legalize it for me and I went twice. Even migraciones here asked me why he didn't legalize it for me and I said, 'No sé'. Well, long story short I came with the doc not ready hence I had to send it back and literally pay the price (because of a stupid deadwood at the embassy).
Darksider415
Well-known member
Depending on which country you're coming from, it can be easy or hard. Jakoval had it harder because Migraciones isn't super familiar with Thai docs and the embassy there seems to be full of ñoquis from the description given.
I did it coming from the US, while married to a Brazilian and it was easy, but bureaucratic. (Brazilians have a right to permanent residency under Ley 26.240)
Went to ReNaPer and got my fingerprint cards done in ink, sent them off to Monument Visa in the US for channeling/apostille, then had it translated here. Biggest pain is that we did the expedited tramite and we didn't have our Argentine antecedentes penales done prior. If you do the expedited tramite in Migraciones, go with your local criminal record certificate already done and you'll save a few days. Brazilian docs don't require apostille or translation, so that saved some hassle for my wife's, at least.
Other than that, send them a letter through the contact form every 48 hours or so after the 30 day mark and it's not bad, as long as you clearly fall into one of the categories. My wife's was 56 days start to finish and mine was 78 days. After that, it's just waiting on the DNI, though you can travel as long as you have a copy of the decree granting residency with you. My DNI took about a month and a half after the result, my wife's actually came a week after mine did. ReNaPer.
Uncle Wong
Well-known member
Thanks @Jakoval and @Darksider415 for these tips. I will go through the process maybe end of this year or next year and these are some good tips.
Jakoval
Well-known member
These ñoquis are so 'unfamiliar' (I use this word loosely because I don't believe so. Because there have been other Thais before me using the same certificate without any problem) that they asked me to get a new police clearance because the one I provided did not exactly say that "I have or don't have criminal record". The thing is the police clearance issued by my home country uses a general wording like 'This is certify that Mr.XXX has no behavior endangering the peace and order of the state blah blah blah.....' I had to write a letter explaining that even if I get a new certificate, it will be the same thing because it's the standard format. Everyone gets the same certificate and wording and that this wording means I have no criminal record. I also attached the police headquarters website where it shows the sample of the clearance. That was actually the last obstacle before my PR was granted. Glad I don't have to deal with migraciones again.
earlyretirement
Moderator
I think much just depends on the person you are getting and the mood they are in for that day. One set of documents that might work one day won't with the SAME person the next day. These employees for many of these agencies are terrible! People hate working in Argentina. Many of these documents and procedures are just idiotic in migraciones.
Jakoval
Well-known member
When my partner and I had our interview with Migraciones, the interviewer also complained to us about being on a contract instead of a permanent position, among other things. I suppose that's one of the reasons why they work the way they work? Dunno.
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